Hams Updated Mock Draft (4/17)

[gmf1369]

it all comes from what jeremiah said. he also said he thought rosen was the 2nd best QB in the draft. and nowhere did he say sliding out of the top 25 or even 20. there are way too many QB needy teams to think that happens. you think the dolphins, bills (if they don't trade up), cardinals, redskins, chargers, giants (if they swap with the bills) all pass on him?


1) Josh Rosen is the QB most likely to slide: Everyone I've talked to around the league believes there will be three quarterbacks selected within the first five picks of the draft. That means someone out of the "big four" QBs -- USC's Sam Darnold, Wyoming's Josh Allen, Oklahoma's Baker Mayfield and UCLA's Rosen -- could slide a little bit. When I bring up this topic with personnel executives, Rosen is the one they point to as the most likely slider of the group. I personally believe Rosen is the second-best quarterback in the draft class behind Darnold, but the former Bruins QB might fall out of the top 10. Why? Part of it comes back to the durability concerns for Rosen that we've heard about throughout the process. We'll continue to hear people question his intangibles as a leader, but that's far less of a concern than the fact that he missed half his sophomore year with a shoulder injury and suffered two concussions last season.

you do realize there are teams that like the QBs not named Darnold, Rosen, Allen and Mayfield...

some teams like Mason Rudolph, Lamar Jackson Kyle Lauletta and Luke Falk better than the so called top 4..

Just saying not every team in the first round will take a QB, the expectation is the Jets and Browns must take one but the other teams are not in MUST mode...

 

[hobson54]

you do realize there are teams that like the QBs not named Darnold, Rosen, Allen and Mayfield...

some teams like Mason Rudolph, Lamar Jackson Kyle Lauletta and Luke Falk better than the so called top 4..

Just saying not every team in the first round will take a QB, the expectation is the Jets and Browns must take one but the other teams are not in MUST mode...

while granting it may be possible, how exactly do you know that some teams like those others guys better? are you privy to teams' draft boards?

in the end, the draft will reveal what teams think. i highly doubt rosen falls outside the top 25 like you suggest. i've been wrong many times, so i'm not holding myself to be some expert. but i find it hard to believe the guy many think is the most pro ready of what is considered a deep (albeit flawed) QB class will fall so far. i think it's more likely rosen is taken before mayfield, but again, we will find out in just over a week.

 

[gmf1369]

while granting it may be possible, how exactly do you know that some teams like those others guys better? are you privy to teams' draft boards?

in the end, the draft will reveal what teams think. i highly doubt rosen falls outside the top 25 like you suggest. i've been wrong many times, so i'm not holding myself to be some expert. but i find it hard to believe the guy many think is the most pro ready of what is considered a deep (albeit flawed) QB class will fall so far. i think it's more likely rosen is taken before mayfield, but again, we will find out in just over a week.

again I am not suggesting, I am reiterating what is being said out in the media...

if you actually read my posts about Rosen you would see I would take a chance on him from a football stand point, if we didn't just sign Bridgewater and re-sign McCown... Also stated he is pro ready, can start day one type of QB that with his accuracy makes him worthy of said pick...

but you keep on tearing down my posts to argue on why I don't like him, or think he is capable or whatever... I state what is, what they are saying about him...

the Jets have been linked to Rosen (4 x visits) Darnold (2 x visits) Allen (2 x visits) Mayfield (12 x visits) just off the linked too meeting each time is some kind of visit, makes you wonder why so many times for Mayfield who since he declared has taken steps to better his persona, he hasn't been in trouble nor has he be out spoken in the media...

as for Rosen things are popping up, his former coach talked down about him and football people around the league are suggesting things through the media maybe for his stock to slip or it is the truth...

Dolphins are said to like Lamar Jackson and Mason Rudolph
Bills are said to like Josh Allen and Josh Rosen
Patriots are said to like Kyle Lauletta and Lamar Jackson
Broncos are said to like Baker Mayfield and Mason Rudolph
Cardinals are said to like Mason Rudolph and Kyle Lauletta
Ravens are said to like Lamar Jackson and Kyle Lauletta

again this all could be smoke screen and people are trying to get their pick/prospect to fall by talking others up or there might be something to it...

and before you ask I do my homework, don't ask I won't reveal my sources who are actual people....

 

[hobson54]

again I am not suggesting, I am reiterating what is being said out in the media...

if you actually read my posts about Rosen you would see I would take a chance on him from a football stand point, if we didn't just sign Bridgewater and re-sign McCown... Also stated he is pro ready, can start day one type of QB that with his accuracy makes him worthy of said pick...

but you keep on tearing down my posts to argue on why I don't like him, or think he is capable or whatever... I state what is, what they are saying about him...

the Jets have been linked to Rosen (4 x visits) Darnold (2 x visits) Allen (2 x visits) Mayfield (12 x visits) just off the linked too meeting each time is some kind of visit, makes you wonder why so many times for Mayfield who since he declared has taken steps to better his persona, he hasn't been in trouble nor has he be out spoken in the media...

as for Rosen things are popping up, his former coach talked down about him and football people around the league are suggesting things through the media maybe for his stock to slip or it is the truth...

Dolphins are said to like Lamar Jackson and Mason Rudolph
Bills are said to like Josh Allen and Josh Rosen
Patriots are said to like Kyle Lauletta and Lamar Jackson
Broncos are said to like Baker Mayfield and Mason Rudolph
Cardinals are said to like Mason Rudolph and Kyle Lauletta
Ravens are said to like Lamar Jackson and Kyle Lauletta

again this all could be smoke screen and people are trying to get their pick/prospect to fall by talking others up or there might be something to it...

and before you ask I do my homework, don't ask I won't reveal my sources who are actual people....

wouldn't one assume that teams who are picking in the later part of the round aren't even looking at the guys expected to go earlier? without questioning your sources/knowledge, for all those teams you listed showing them liking guys like rudolph, jackson and lauletta, how come none of them like darnold, rosen, mayfield or allen? the obvious answer is they assume those guys won't be there. you think the cards or ravens would pass on darnold for the guys you listed?

as to rosen, having mccown and bridgewater should not be a reason to not draft a guy. it's not like being "pro ready" should be taken as a bad thing. mccown had a nice year, but he's a guy who probably would have retired if the jets signed cousins. and bridgewater may or may not ever be able to resume his career. you don't pass on a guy because you have a guy trying to beat father time once again and another coming back from major, major surgery. if rosen is able to play day 1, let him earn the job. if not, he can sit for a year (or less) until it's his turn. same would apply to darnold, allen or mayfield.

 

[gmf1369]

gonna make my final stand here:

Browns have a bridge guy for one to two years in Tyrod Taylor who could become a legit long term answer... With that saying they don't need a pro ready option which makes sense why both Sam Darnold and Josh Allen are the front two names being associated with the No. 1 Overall pick... Both these prospects will need time to sit and develop...

As for the Giants, they have Eli and Webb on the roster... Depending on how long they think Eli can play is whether they will take a QB here (only if it is Sam Darnold) otherwise they will do one of two things: draft RB Saquon Barkley which makes the most sense or trade out of the No. 2 pick...

For us, it comes down to this the which QB left on the board is the can't miss prospect... Meaning after year one he will be given the keys to the castle and has to be ready not only to take field but tackle the new york bottom feeders called the reporters... So if Browns go either or, then the Giants take the RB there will be two or three on the board... Assuming Darnold goes number one, do you take the best overall on the field QB, a pro ready frail accurate option with some questions, or do you take the prototypical measurable option that could be the Big Ben or Flacco type option?

Put it this way do you think J. Bates has the ballz to say I want Josh Allen because he has the size, length, arm and athleticism for me to mold my idea of what an NFL QB should be with the help of Teddy Bridgewater and Josh McCown in the QB room... Is the decision solely on Head Coach Todd Bowles, and will he go after the bravado of an unusual sized QB like Mayfield at worst can possibly convert him to safety... <<< just joking... Or is it solely the decision of Mike Maccagnan who needs a pro ready option in case of the failure in signing Bridgewater and McCown gets injured so making Rosen the likely choice....

So many what ifs, but the main what if is did we prematurely trade up to draft one of these four options when the 5th best QB is actually the best of the bunch...

After trading up taking a so called top QB do we possibly grab another with our 3rd Round, just saying maybe that 3rd/4th rounder could be our this years Kirk Cousins...

 

[gmf1369]

wouldn't one assume that teams who are picking in the later part of the round aren't even looking at the guys expected to go earlier? without questioning your sources/knowledge, for all those teams you listed showing them liking guys like rudolph, jackson and lauletta, how come none of them like darnold, rosen, mayfield or allen? the obvious answer is they assume those guys won't be there. you think the cards or ravens would pass on darnold for the guys you listed?

as to rosen, having mccown and bridgewater should not be a reason to not draft a guy. it's not like being "pro ready" should be taken as a bad thing. mccown had a nice year, but he's a guy who probably would have retired if the jets signed cousins. and bridgewater may or may not ever be able to resume his career. you don't pass on a guy because you have a guy trying to beat father time once again and another coming back from major, major surgery. if rosen is able to play day 1, let him earn the job. if not, he can sit for a year (or less) until it's his turn. same would apply to darnold, allen or mayfield.

again this is what is floating out there on whom they are said to like... did those teams meet with those other prospects, some did others didn't because they just assumed they are out of reach for them to acquire without giving up the kitchen sink...

you pass on a guy that you feel is not for your team... so if General Manager Mike Maccagnan, Head Coach Todd Bowles, Offensive Coordinator Jeremy Bates all believe that Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, Josh Allen or Josh Rosen is their guy they will pull the trigger... End of Story, see you next week...

 

[BlindsideD'Brick]

This entire discussion just highlights how important this pick is.

 

[hobson54]

while i have much less time than i used to to follow the ins-and-outs of the draft, as a long-time observer of the draft (some of my fellow former scout posters can vouch for my past postings), one thing i've learned a long time ago is to ignore what is "floating out there" in terms of which teams like which players.

i was just noting that your post saying various teams like various QBs not named rosen doesn't really mean much when those same teams apparently also don't like darnold, allen or mayfield for the most part. and that is because those teams are drafting after these QBs are expected to be off the board. of course, players do fall, as we all know the mock drafts and online rankings are no substitute for what actual GMs and scouts do and think.

not sure why you seem so defensive in these posts. none of us know how this is gonna shake out. we each may have preferences, but we also have incomplete information. and i'm sure we all are hoping the jets finally land a franchise QB.

 

[TebowCan'tThrow]

Even though I don't like Mayziel personally. I also don't like things about his game. The biggest thing I hate is he will bring the circus back to the Jets. We spent so much time trying to get rid of it.

 

[Gramoah]

Even though I don't like Mayziel personally. I also don't like things about his game. The biggest thing I hate is he will bring the circus back to the Jets. We spent so much time trying to get rid of it.

Amen on the circus. I want the Jets talked about, but, for winning, not the circus atmosphere that we are finally or at least mostly rid of. This team just doesn't get the respect that most other teams get and it's about time that changed. If they do select Mayfield I hope he leaves his circus shirt at home. If he doesn't the New York media will eat him alive and the rest of the team along with him. I have no doubt that he can play, but, can he conduct himself in a mature and professional manner ? Like I said before, I have issues with all of these so called top QBs and that's my issue with him.

 

[TebowCan'tThrow]

Amen on the circus. I want the Jets talked about, but, for winning, not the circus atmosphere that we are finally or at least mostly rid of. This team just doesn't get the respect that most other teams get and it's about time that changed. If they do select Mayfield I hope he leaves his circus shirt at home. If he doesn't the New York media will eat him alive and the rest of the team along with him. I have no doubt that he can play, but, can he conduct himself in a mature and professional manner ? Like I said before, I have issues with all of these so called top QBs and that's my issue with him.

Even though I don't him now, he can change my mind. If he comes in and keeps his mouth shut and works. When he gets his chance, if he starts grabbing his crotch and embarrasses this team then I will be against him even more than I am now. Win with class and I will like him. Problem with Baker is he loves being Baker and that will probably get magnified in NY. He gets one chance to win me over.

 

[NewMFS62]

while i have much less time than i used to to follow the ins-and-outs of the draft, as a long-time observer of the draft (some of my fellow former scout posters can vouch for my past postings), one thing i've learned a long time ago is to ignore what is "floating out there" in terms of which teams like which players.

I vouch. But I'm getting too old to do it too often.
Later

 

[Green Jets & Ham]

Its already been noted in this thread, starting with GMF who pays as close attention to this stuff as anyone, but Daniel Jeremiah (former scout, which is to say, a part of the club) has been told that if any of the BIG 4 QB's slides on draft day, it will be Rosen, not Mayfield. If that information is accurate, I got the order in which they are drafted pretty right, and I didn't even know that. I'm more comfortable with Mayfield > Rosen now than I was before I posted this mock and knew that.

What I'm still not sure about is Mayfield > Allen.

Not because Mayfield isn't better than Allen now, HE IS, but because everyone knows Allen has the highest ceiling of any QB in this draft.

 

[TebowCan'tThrow]

Its already been noted in this thread, starting with GMF who pays as close attention to this stuff as anyone, but Daniel Jeremiah (former scout, which is to say, a part of the club) has been told that if any of the BIG 4 QB's slides on draft day, it will be Rosen, not Mayfield. If that information is accurate, I got the order in which they are drafted pretty right, and I didn't even know that. I'm more comfortable with Mayfield > Rosen now than I was before I posted this mock and knew that.

What I'm still not sure about is Mayfield > Allen.

Not because Mayfield isn't better than Allen now, HE IS, but because everyone knows Allen has the highest ceiling of any QB in this draft.

All I know is we traded three 2nd round picks and I bet not one other team in the NFL would have done that for him. And it just so happens to be the worst franchise in the league at drafting QB's so there is no way it could fail.

 

[jetgreen13]

All I know is we traded three 2nd round picks and I bet not one other team in the NFL would have done that for him. And it just so happens to be the worst franchise in the league at drafting QB's so there is no way it could fail.

i'm certainly not a maccagnan apologist & i have no idea how he lists the big 4..

but if an organization leaves a GM in sink or swim position like this, that GM is going to try & save his own ass..

that's on woody's brother..

 

[BlindsideD'Brick]

FWIW.....

Todd McShay said he’s hearing around league circles that the Jets will take Mayfield at 3. Again, a lot of smoke going on right now, but the Mayfield-to-the-Jets noise is getting louder.

 

[hobson54]

Its already been noted in this thread, starting with GMF who pays as close attention to this stuff as anyone, but Daniel Jeremiah (former scout, which is to say, a part of the club) has been told that if any of the BIG 4 QB's slides on draft day, it will be Rosen, not Mayfield. If that information is accurate, I got the order in which they are drafted pretty right, and I didn't even know that. I'm more comfortable with Mayfield > Rosen now than I was before I posted this mock and knew that.

What I'm still not sure about is Mayfield > Allen.

Not because Mayfield isn't better than Allen now, HE IS, but because everyone knows Allen has the highest ceiling of any QB in this draft.

jeremiah (the former scout) also says he thinks rosen is the 2nd best QB in the draft after darnold. he says he thinks if he slides, it will be because of injury concerns, not talent and not questions about intangibles.

 

[jetgreen13]

jeremiah (the former scout) also says he thinks rosen is the 2nd best QB in the draft after darnold. he says he thinks if he slides, it will be because of injury concerns, not talent and not questions about intangibles.

do you have a horse in the race??

 

[hobson54]

do you have a horse in the race??

not sure what you mean by a horse in the race.

as a fan, i have preferences. my list would be

1 - darnold
2 - rosen
3 - allen
4 - mayfield

 

[jetgreen13]

not sure what you mean by a horse in the race.

as a fan, i have preferences. my list would be

1 - darnold
2 - rosen
3 - allen
4 - mayfield

perfect!! you're someone to ask.. i'm someone who does not pay any attention to college football until it applies to the upcoming draft.. why is your 1st choice the guy with legitimate interception/ball security issues??

what jumps out at you about the kid??