State of the New York Jets - Defense

gmf1369

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Like the offense, the needs are few and far between then fans want to admit. The secondary has been bitten by injuries and not one but two potential starters lost for the season. Marcus Maye a fan favorite albeit football player only, off the field another discussion not for now. Could he be franchised tag again, or will they walk away from him because of his legal situation? The other was brought in for his first year with the Jets is LaMarcus Joyner but will have to see if they attempt to offer him another opportunity for another year or decline. Sharrod Neasman, Jarrod Wilson are solid options as role players. But with the signing of Eagles practice squad player Elijah Riley the Jets may have found their second starting safety with Ashtyn Davis who has been a bright spot this year.

In the secondary, the corner position is the youngest around the league and don't play like it. Led by Bryce Hall, second year man this unit has potential as is with Michael Carter II and Brandin Echols as the other starters. Depth in Isaiah Dunn, Jason Pinnock and special teams ace Justin Hardee. They also signed rookie corner Rachad Wildgoose off the Buffalo Bills practice squad, has potential of being an intricate role player moving forward. This position is set, if anything it is a luxury position if the Jets find someone they must have.

The real state of the defense lies in the linebacking group. CJ Mosley, Jarrad Davis, Blake Cashman are the veterans and of the three only one has any real importance but his contract to play states otherwise. One was given a shot to prove he is not a bust and the other can not stay on the field long enough to be effective. The team drafted two safeties converted them to linebacker. Jamien Sherwood unfortunately is out for the season, but Hamsah Nasirildeen has seen action and has been steadily improving over the last few weeks. The NEED is at this position and not just one role.
  • MIKE; middle LB/captain of the unit and “gap destroyer” against the run, key “read defender” both pre-snap and at the heart of zone coverages.
  • SAM; strongside LB that usually matches up with the tight end in the passing game or the “deep hook” zone, assigned gap defender against the run that may also blitz on occasion.
  • WILL; the most “athletic” player in this group is generally the weakside LB, known for his elite open-field tackling on cutbacks and his zone coverage ability in the flats.
Jamien Sherwood as more potential as the SAM LB role but that was given to CJ Mosley who constantly is being taken advantage of against all the Tight Ends he has faced this season. Nasirildeen is fine at the WILL LB role as he continues to improve each week since coming back from his injury. Everyone believed that CJ Mosley would be the MIKE as he was a true run defender in a 3-4 alignment so it is going to be interesting if they fill voids or replace current players.

The other position of luxury comes across the defensive line. There are two positions that have an opening through the draft to select a developmental options. There are free agent targets that also can solve this mystery. And there are in house options to be re-signed. The actual breakdown on playing time is where they want it to be, but the communication between the defensive line and the linebackers has been missing which has led to a lot of miscues to where the production has been non existent. Changes will have to be made, players will move on other players may be signed and/or drafted but there is no actual NEED here.

Second Round: Four Options at Linebacker:
  • Christian Harris, Alabama
  • Brandon Smith, Penn State
  • Nolan Smith, Georgia
  • DeMarvion Overshown, Texas
Third Round: Four Options at Defensive Tackle
  • Phidarian Mathis, Alabama
  • Travis Jones, Connecticut
  • Haskell Garrett, Ohio State
  • Neil Farrell Jr. Louisiana State
Fourth Round: Four Options at Defensive End
  • Ali Gaye, Louisiana State
  • Sam Williams, Ole Miss
  • Jeffrey Gunter: Coastal Carolina
  • Isaiah Thomas: Oklahoma
Fifth Round: Six Options at Defensive Back
  • Derion Kendrick, Georgia (CB)
  • Tre Sterling, Oklahoma State (SAF)
  • Jack Jones, Arizona State (CB)
  • Markquese Bell, Florida A&M (SAF)
  • Avery Young, Rutgers (CB)
  • Chase Lucas, Arizona State (CB)
Again for this team to win and have a successful defense it starts with the roles in the front seven. Fix the linebacking roles and fill the void on the defensive line either through free agency or re-signing our own free agents. Get healthy is also key. The linebackers to be replaced are at least two in Blake Cashman and Jarrad Davis. The rookies should continue their uptick development and become mainstays at their current positions. Also feel drafting a key cog in the second round if fortunate to land a player like Alabama's Christian Harris he would stabilize one of the three starting jobs.

Defensive line is not that far off. Injuries derailed the pressure but the potential is there. Bryce Huff should be more of the immediate future. Carl Lawson injury hurts but opens the door for others to step in and contribute. Shaq Lawson has done an acceptable job. But the interior has been less than expected. JFM has also proved his capabilities but the consistency is not there from week to week. Will Fatukasi earn a new contract, yet to be seen but he has proven he can excel in this new scheme. Sheperd has also shown flashes. Rankins is under contract for next season and has proven he fits the design but more as a role player. Fix the line, find one or two options either in free agency or the draft. The front seven next year should be unstoppable.

Given a full year of the secondary evolving this defense is on the right trajectory, struggles were always going to be this year because a lot of youth in a new system. Not only learning on the fly but also trying to develop chemistry. Like I said the one stand out that people are down on, is Safety Ashtyn Davis is tied for the lead in forced fumbles (3) with Quincy Williams. He also had his first career interception. He has 38 solo tackles and is 7th on the team in total tackles with 45. Yes he has been accredited with 17 receptions against out of 19 but again miss communication from the front seven leaving him out of place miscued this stat against him. Also blown coverage after Brandin Echols went out with injury he was also gifted those receptions clearly should of went to Guidry for blown assignment. Of the actual 17 (11) were on him which is still a high number but his PFF rating is still acceptable as of RN his rating is 68.8 for the year. Over the last two games with Riley as his running mate, Ashtyn's PFF rating has been good over 76.
 

NewMFS62

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No QB in the history of the game has completed a pass from a prone position.
They need someone who can consistently put the other QB in the dirt, someone the other team has to game plan against.
Desperately.
Later
 

Tinstar

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No QB in the history of the game has completed a pass from a prone position.
They need someone who can consistently put the other QB in the dirt, someone the other team has to game plan against.
Desperately.
Later
That was supposed to be Carl Lawson but unfortunately he won’t be back at full strength for about another two seasons. I really don’t care who it is as long as we get us an edge ru as her capable of getting to the QB .
 

gmf1369

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was suppose to be Carl Lawson
was suppose to be Bryce Huff
both are injured, but Huff is suppose to be coming back soon
with Huff out the responsibilities on the D Line have changed
Shaq Lawson, and a mix of Ronald Blair and Jabari Zuniga can only do so much
Blair did get a sack, Zuniga is still a raw prospect and Tim Ward is a work in progress
but when you have only one side that can bring pressure and the interior is not able to push the pocket
then the front 4 is worthless especially since the linebackers are not blitzing as we are accustomed to seeing but that was a 3-4 alignment

new system, new assignments a lot of adjustments they are all learning
tired everyone knew that it was going to be a process and there would be hiccups
seriously though individual achievements are being met while the real process is becoming a unit not a group of individuals

like on offense when LDT took over for GVR his pass protection that first game was not up to snuff but it was clearly better than GVR

with Rankins out, the rotation suffered.
Q and JFM try to do their jobs.
but Foley, Sheperd have to step up.
the rookie Marshall is raw.
with the disarray on the D Line the linebackers need to fill in those gaps and be better.
Quincy Williams, CJ Mosley can only do so much.

it is a process and they are building.
 

skop

The Green Knight
Jet Fanatics
No QB in the history of the game has completed a pass from a prone position.
They need someone who can consistently put the other QB in the dirt, someone the other team has to game plan against.
Desperately.
Later

from @gmf1369's list of DE's, Sam Williams and Isiah Thomas are my favorites. Both are twitchy, and both are BIG men.
they can get to the QB and will demand double teams, and as you said, they ain't throwin' if they're prone.

i think we should make an effort to get both. put JFM inside with Q, and those monsters on the outside.

Rank...is a sub.
Shep...if kept a sub.
Foley...if kept a sub.
Zuniga...if kept a sub.
Huff...a meaningful rotation player!
 

skop

The Green Knight
Jet Fanatics
was suppose to be Carl Lawson
was suppose to be Bryce Huff
both are injured, but Huff is suppose to be coming back soon
with Huff out the responsibilities on the D Line have changed
Shaq Lawson, and a mix of Ronald Blair and Jabari Zuniga can only do so much
Blair did get a sack, Zuniga is still a raw prospect and Tim Ward is a work in progress
but when you have only one side that can bring pressure and the interior is not able to push the pocket
then the front 4 is worthless especially since the linebackers are not blitzing as we are accustomed to seeing but that was a 3-4 alignment

new system, new assignments a lot of adjustments they are all learning
tired everyone knew that it was going to be a process and there would be hiccups
seriously though individual achievements are being met while the real process is becoming a unit not a group of individuals

like on offense when LDT took over for GVR his pass protection that first game was not up to snuff but it was clearly better than GVR

with Rankins out, the rotation suffered.
Q and JFM try to do their jobs.
but Foley, Sheperd have to step up.
the rookie Marshall is raw.
with the disarray on the D Line the linebackers need to fill in those gaps and be better.
Quincy Williams, CJ Mosley can only do so much.

it is a process and they are building.

1.) when you listen to Saleh speak about the D, and especially the D Line, he is quoted as saying that "a monkey can call plays for our defense".
2.) when you listen to the individual linemen speak about their job, they (paraphrasing) say it's just to pin your ears back and get after it.

the problem is "the rotation".
the problems "are in the building".

Foley, nor Shep command double teams and cannot adequately "AND" routinely shed single blocks to (a.) get into the backfield on running plays, or (b.) collapse pockets so JFM or the opposite end can chase a QB running for his life. IMO, those guys are goal line players who AT BEST hold the L.O.S.

FTR, i have a soft spot for them, and love their stories, but on any other team, they aren't playing the percentage of plays they are...and we shouldn't be playing them as much. We aren't going anywhere and we know what they have to offer so let's go young!!

While Rank is out, give Kyle Phillips all the snaps he can handle, and keep Q in until his wheels fall off.
When Huff is back, play him every down with Zuniga on the other side. Let Blair sub for them for a breather.

That gets more energy and more explosion on the field; which according to Saleh himself, is "the system".
 

gmf1369

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the problem is "the rotation".
the problems "are in the building".

Foley, nor Shep command double teams and cannot adequately "AND" routinely shed single blocks to (a.) get into the backfield on running plays, or (b.) collapse pockets so JFM or the opposite end can chase a QB running for his life. IMO, those guys are goal line players who AT BEST hold the L.O.S.

FTR, i have a soft spot for them, and love their stories, but on any other team, they aren't playing the percentage of plays they are...and we shouldn't be playing them as much. We aren't going anywhere and we know what they have to offer so let's go young!!

While Rank is out, give Kyle Phillips all the snaps he can handle, and keep Q in until his wheels fall off.
When Huff is back, play him every down with Zuniga on the other side. Let Blair sub for them for a breather.

That gets more energy and more explosion on the field; which according to Saleh himself, is "the system".
the problem is they are learning intricacies of their individual positions
the problem is the coaching staff is trying to simplify the terminology
the problem is their a lack of chemistry
the problem is the players are building continuity
the problem is this is the first year for everyone on this team to work in a 4-3 defense
the problem is this was a no expectation year
the problem is fans are impatient

the problem is the talent does not fit the scheme
Kyle Phillips was a decent 3-4 OLB but his game does not translate to a 4-3 DE
Without Bryce Huff there is no EDGE presence
Without formidable speed off both DE positions the interior are laying back rather then pushing the pocket
the problem is fans want to bitch about everything

the problem is year one NO EXPECTATIONS, enjoy the positive play but don't cry about the negative ones

after this season there is going to be turnover players cut, traded and released.
free agents will be signed to bolster the rotation properly
draft picks will be selected to continue the rebuild of the roster
next year will be interesting and should see progress

Zuniga and Blair are done for the season to be called up unless they sign them both to the active roster
Bryce Huff should come back next week
Bryce Huff and JFM at DE will bring more balance and pressure
Phillips and Shaq will sub in and out
Q. and Foley then will be able to collapse the pocket
Rankins and Sheperd will sub in and continue to bolster up front

injuries killed us this year but fit also was a problem
 

skop

The Green Knight
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the problem is they are learning intricacies of their individual positions
the problem is the coaching staff is trying to simplify the terminology
the problem is their a lack of chemistry
the problem is the players are building continuity
the problem is this is the first year for everyone on this team to work in a 4-3 defense
the problem is this was a no expectation year
the problem is fans are impatient

the problem is the talent does not fit the scheme
Kyle Phillips was a decent 3-4 OLB but his game does not translate to a 4-3 DE
Without Bryce Huff there is no EDGE presence
Without formidable speed off both DE positions the interior are laying back rather then pushing the pocket
the problem is fans want to bitch about everything

the problem is year one NO EXPECTATIONS, enjoy the positive play but don't cry about the negative ones

after this season there is going to be turnover players cut, traded and released.
free agents will be signed to bolster the rotation properly
draft picks will be selected to continue the rebuild of the roster
next year will be interesting and should see progress

Zuniga and Blair are done for the season to be called up unless they sign them both to the active roster
Bryce Huff should come back next week
Bryce Huff and JFM at DE will bring more balance and pressure
Phillips and Shaq will sub in and out
Q. and Foley then will be able to collapse the pocket
Rankins and Sheperd will sub in and continue to bolster up front

injuries killed us this year but fit also was a problem

there are fans who had no expectations for wins and losses...count me in!!
there are fans who watch each game with the intent to see positives & progress that make themselves apparent; and also to see where the team needs to focus...count me in!!!

i am not impatient; not even close.

however, i have seen Foley and Shep for years. they underwhelmed in a 3-4 set, and they are doing the same in a 4-3 set.
moreover, we have seen the Shaq act underwhelm in BUFF, and MIA and TX. we are seeing a replay.
"the bases are loaded and Casey's at bat...." fill in the blank.

WADR, you are prone to being caught up in the players vs. the scheme a bit too much. And i might entangle myself in the argument that talent will translate into transferrable skills to make up for not having a scheme fit....conceded!

but, again, Saleh said the DLine is about dominating Olines with both guns a blazin'...that doesn't sound like an intricate scheme to me. it sounds like winning against the hat that is on you. Perhaps (?!!?) we should put some nuances into the line play to get doubles and trips off of Q & JFM? I can't remember a stunt after the TN game. Can you?

Q will never reach his potential as long as he is absorbing what Foley and Shep do not garner. Same goes for JFM.
i do not think it's "impatient" to want to see younger raw guys to see if they'd be progress over what we have already seen.
it's just wanting to see something different.

standing pat...

1.) problem is the rotation.
2.) problem is underwhelming results from those who have already underwhelmed.
 

gmf1369

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however, i have seen Foley and Shep for years. they underwhelmed in a 3-4 set, and they are doing the same in a 4-3 set.
moreover, we have seen the Shaq act underwhelm in BUFF, and MIA and TX. we are seeing a replay.
"the bases are loaded and Casey's at bat...." fill in the blank.

WADR, you are prone to being caught up in the players vs. the scheme a bit too much. And i might entangle myself in the argument that talent will translate into transferrable skills to make up for not having a scheme fit....conceded!

but, again, Saleh said the DLine is about dominating Olines with both guns a blazin'...that doesn't sound like an intricate scheme to me. it sounds like winning against the hat that is on you. Perhaps (?!!?) we should put some nuances into the line play to get doubles and trips off of Q & JFM? I can't remember a stunt after the TN game. Can you?

Q will never reach his potential as long as he is absorbing what Foley and Shep do not garner. Same goes for JFM.
i do not think it's "impatient" to want to see younger raw guys to see if they'd be progress over what we have already seen.
it's just wanting to see something different.

standing pat...

1.) problem is the rotation.
2.) problem is underwhelming results from those who have already underwhelmed.
when there is not enough balance at certain spots then those employed stunts and gap control are off as they have been since Huff got hurt. with his injury compounded on top of the loss of Carl Lawson the defensive line has no balance. Yes at Houston both JFM and Q. were able to get home to the QB. so did Shaq. because of Shaq they were able to collapse the pocket because he was able to add pressure with Kyle Phillips off the edge.

depth is a problem, rotations is a problem.
Sheperd was a 5th round draft pick
Fatukasi was a 6th round draft pick
both have exceeded expectations
both are gap controlled run defenders
Foley over Sheperd as he has made tackles for loss
Consistency from both is underwhelming
but they succeed when the others are holding their own
regardless of Carl Lawson
regardless of Bryce Huff
regardless of whatever or if we sign a FA or 2
regardless if we draft a prospect or 2
the same result will be what we are seeing this year
gap control, scheme fit, verbiage and continuity all play in what we need to build chemistry not only on the D Line but as a defense in a whole. linebackers need to work by setting the edge, linebackers need to plug the rushing lanes. linebackers need to be better period.

secondary is growing they are young but they are the best part of our defense.
defensive line has the best talent across the board.
linebackers simply the glue to this defense, they go we go.
 

skop

The Green Knight
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69fa8332-5fb2-4f8e-a4d2-f458a6de0d3a_text.gif
 

Retired AFA

Repeat Offender Pro Bowler
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I disagree here. I believe CB is a major issue and we need one badly. I would propose taking a CB with our second 1st Rd pick unless DT Jordan Davis of Georgia is available, then I would scoop him up. I would then take a CB with our first 2nd Rd pick. If Davis is not available, take the best CB and grab a WR with our first 2nd Rd pick. Linebackers and a kicker can be picked up in the 3rd, 4th, and 5th Rds.
 

TonyFtLaud

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I thought the correct answer was Tennessee.
That's the last place the D was seen
 

Tinstar

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I disagree here. I believe CB is a major issue and we need one badly. I would propose taking a CB with our second 1st Rd pick unless DT Jordan Davis of Georgia is available, then I would scoop him up. I would then take a CB with our first 2nd Rd pick. If Davis is not available, take the best CB and grab a WR with our first 2nd Rd pick. Linebackers and a kicker can be picked up in the 3rd, 4th, and 5th Rds.
Much will be decided over the last 5 weeks if both of our starting CBs can finish the season healthy . Furthermore how we finish record wise and also the Seahawks .
 

skop

The Green Knight
Jet Fanatics
I thought the correct answer was Tennessee.
That's the last place the D was seen

I whole heartedly agree here. they were the ones who won that game. TN was not completely healthy at WR, but they had King Henry and he makes any player who suits up for them better.

they ran stunts seamlessly, and pretty much shut down The King. i was thinking that game was a harbinger of things to come, but injuries took a toll, and they stopped winning individual match-ups.
 

gmf1369

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too many injuries and not enough proper depth to fill the void on responsibility from said positions has left us vulnerable

remember first year, left over roster from Brilliant Offensive Mind and Father - In - Law

this team needs a new vigor
this team needs new blood
this team is learning how to play
this team is building chemistry
this team has to learn how to win
 

gastineau

Transition Tagged
Jet Fanatics
Jets Defense is Great! Run Stopping,Pass Cranking ,and dont Forget the SACK MACHINE QB KILLERS! Yep Jets Deffense is awesome against PeeWee League of kids 10. Make me Proud to know my grand children can play on Jets and hold their own.....🤣
 

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I'm really not sold on Linebackers in the 2022 Draft. Defense is stacked with DE, DT, CB, Edge, FS. Why reach? Take what the Draft gives you. There is always Free Agency and the year after Draft.
 
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