This roster isn't Devoid of Talent.The problem

[lounap23]

I honestly can't think of a position where we don't have talent

QB you say - I say wrong we have talent i.e.. Petty and Hack... just need development and we all know I feel like Petty is ready

RB - Forte and Powell only issue here is Forte's age... RB's can be had in later rds

WR - Well I think Macc nailed it w/J. Marshall, Peake and Anderson this summer and Enunwas development. to go along w/Deck & Marshall

OL - Listen I though here is where we need help but the performance of Winters/Qvale/Ijalana makes me think late rd depth is all we need and we need to find Mangolds replacement... but I think we have another year or 2 for that

TE - With ASJ the talent is there


Defense

DL - Nothing needs to be said here

LB - Harris is our weak link but I think Mauldin/Jenkins/ Lee the talent is there

S - Ghilchrist is good - Pryor has the talent when he plays in the box and not over the top coverage

CB - Revis can still play - Roberts looks like a find - Williams has ability - Skrine is great in the slot - Burris kid has shown flashes

So whats the problem?

To me on offense it's Fitz.. Forcing throws and making bad reads. Happened again sunday and that's it

On Defense

1 - Playing a 4-3... Our 3 best Defensive players are not built for the 4-3 playing all 3 of them at the same time leaves 2 of them playing a technique they are not meant to play.

2 LB - again playing the 4-3 leaves Mauldin exposed. He is effective as an OLB Speed Rusher... Utilizing Harris in Coverage is a mistake

3 - Secondary - Playing Skrines outside anytime is a mistake. He needs to be in the slot. Playing Pryor as the deep safety is also a big mistake....

Why does the defense misscommunicate on the reg.... Well when you have 4-5 (yes McClendon plays out of position as well, he is a NT not a 4-3 DT) guys playing out of position on every play you are gonna have mistakes, mismatches and the results will be big plays....

So in summation.... Bowles needs to make adjustments and make them fast.... Get the D back to 3-4 press coverage with Gilchrist over the top. rotate Richardson/Williams/Wilkerson... They will be fresh and motoring late in the games. Get Mauldin in positions to spped rush and move him around to come from all over the filed.


On offense, well this is the conundrum , I think he has to ride Fitz now to either right himself or we get to 1-6 and he has to go to Petty/ Why Petty and not Geno? Also we must get the TE more involved.. That will help everything

We have to figure out going into next years camp if Petty is gonna be bare minimum a solid backup and give us the offseason to get Hack ready.. Cause Geno will not be here next year... As well as maybe the thought of drafting another QB high in the draft.. Which I am ok with... Draft a QB till you find the guy..

 

[Old#15]

I don't disagree. I think the talent is there also, particularly on defense. The problem on defense is that we are back to playing hesitantly or even slow. I think that is because we have switched to a system that the players are uncomfortable with. By playing a 4 man front, we have guys who are used to, and drafted for that system now starting over again. I may be wrong on this, but it is the only explanation I have with the talent that showed itself to be pretty good last year. Something is clearly off, and I believe it is the scheme. Bowles only answer is that the 4-3 gets his best 3 defensive linemen on the field at the same time, but it also has so many guys playing out of position that they create a worse situation for the entire 11. As I said, I could be completely wrong on this, so if someone smarter has a better answer please ante up.

As far as the offense goes, I think it is the lack of commitment to the running game. I think there is a fear of overusing Forte, particularly after the 1st game. We constantly in 3,4 or 5 wide sets with an empty backfield. It's not fooling anyone anymore and we have become one dimensional. Too much love for BMarshall, and that too has become very obvious to opposing DCs.

 

[gmf1369]

everyone agrees the talent is there what I was thinking the Jets have all the pieces to recreate what Jeff Fisher is doing in L.A. with the Rams...

Like the Mark Barron move to linebacker from safety this team has everything available to copy that defense...

CB1 Darryl Roberts/Juston Burris
CB2 Buster Skrine
NCB Marcus Williams

FS Darrelle Revis/Marcus Williams
SS Marcus Gilchrist/Rontez Miles

MLB David Harris/Erin Henderson
ROLB Darron Lee/Antonio Allen
LOLB Calvin Pryor/Bruce Carter

RE Lorenzo Mauldin/Sheldon Richardson
LE Jordan Jenkins/Mike Catapano

DT Muhammad Wilkerson/Jarvis Jenkins/Sheldon Richardson
DT Steve McClendon/Leonard Williams/Deon Simon

Just as a defensive stand point the defensive line can be more than just Mauldin/Jenkins & crew at the defensive end positions that Mo & company can still play especially on short yardage defensive units...

Revis over the top will help the corners to play better than they are while allow him to key on the QB with time to jump routes using his ball skills... What Bowles has been trying to do with a hybrid base 4-3 incorporating his 3-4 style isn't working but he can now with this group in these positions still execute his 3-4 scheme disguised in a 4-3 set...

Mo, Leonard & Richardson proved they can be effective inside as well as out so why not?

Speed off the edge to either blitz or set the edge gives us the advantage while bringing more defensive backs on the field at all time to prevent no huddle offenses to try to go vertical or whatever... also the speed now at the linebackers spot helps to prevent those short passes that turn into big gains and again with Revis in the back-end he is still an excellent form tackler...

 

[Mainejet]

EVERYONE has been saying this team has a LOT of talent. For CS, I live in NE and every Patsy fan is so totally surprised by how bad the Jets are.

Talent is NOT the issue and it never was.

This is COACHING and nothing else. This CS is incompetent. They do not make any in game adjustments. I am really tired of constantly mentioning in game adjustments also. Todd Bowles knows nothing about playing chess and IMO that makes him unqualified to be a HC........

 

[lounap23]

EVERYONE has been saying this team has a LOT of talent. For CS, I live in NE and every Patsy fan is so totally surprised by how bad the Jets are.

Talent is NOT the issue and it never was.

This is COACHING and nothing else. This CS is incompetent. They do not make any in game adjustments. I am really tired of constantly mentioning in game adjustments also. Todd Bowles knows nothing about playing chess and IMO that makes him unqualified to be a HC........

So far I agree 100% on the Bowles assessment... We aren't firing him mid season so I am not gonna call for his head, yet. He now has 11 games to prove to me he can learn from his mistakes make the adjustments and learn how to play chess NFL style from the HC standpoint.

 

[soj]

have to agree its the coaching .... there are to many good players underperforming...

memo to TB, change the Fking schemes on D.... Tell your OC to stop with the 5 WR sets and start to run the ball more and use play-action. anything is better than nothing...and that is what we have seen so far,

 

[Mainejet]

So far I agree 100% on the Bowles assessment... We aren't firing him mid season so I am not gonna call for his head, yet. He now has 11 games to prove to me he can learn from his mistakes make the adjustments and learn how to play chess NFL style from the HC standpoint.

Honestly, I don't know if he can prove that to you? You have to remember what Bowles problem is. His problems have never been about beating bad teams. He beat 9 bad teams just last season. They all had losing records and he treated them like the bunch of losers that they are.

However, and I have mentioned this many times before, the Jets beat ONE winning team per season. After Baltimore, the Jets schedule gets much easier. Don't be fooled by Bowles beating up on a bunch of flawed teams. This season was about the Jets growing and learning how to beat teams with winning records. Todd Bowles in my estimation after Baltimore has a grand total of THREE games to not only fix the teams current problems, but also show that he can beat teams with winning records and that is only fair.....So ask yourself...If you're being objective and after all you've seen so far this season, is beating a bunch of lottery pick teams and still failing to beat winning teams a satisfactory result? I say NO......And I think you should too.

 

[lounap23]

Honestly, I don't know if he can prove that to you? You have to remember what Bowles problem is. His problems have never been about beating bad teams. He beat 9 bad teams just last season. They all had losing records and he treated them like the bunch of losers that they are.

However, and I have mentioned this many times before, the Jets beat ONE winning team per season. After Baltimore, the Jets schedule gets much easier. Don't be fooled by Bowles beating up on a bunch of flawed teams. This season was about the Jets growing and learning how to beat teams with winning records. Todd Bowles in my estimation after Baltimore has a grand total of THREE games to not only fix the teams current problems, but also show that he can beat teams with winning records and that is only fair.....So ask yourself...If you're being objective and after all you've seen so far this season, is beating a bunch of lottery pick teams and still failing to beat winning teams a satisfactory result? I say NO......And I think you should too.

It's not just about getting the wins we should... It's situational... Last year maybe beating up on non winning teams masked a lot of the errors. But now we see clearly.. We need to see in game adjustments.. We need to see better clock management. etc.... Wins over lesser teams won't mask the issues we know Bowles has but in fairness it is just his 2nd year and as much as I said maybe he should be let got.. We know he's not so let's see if he can grow

 

[NewMFS62]

The problem is not entirely coaching, it is execution.
Teams knew the Green Bay sweep was coming. They just couldn't stop it.
The Bobby Lane Steelers? The play sequence was fullback Tom Tracy up the middle, running back John Henry Johnson off tackle and then pass to tight end Preston Carpenter. And they kept running that sequence all game until they were stopped or scored.
And there have been other instances where the defense knew what was coming. But the plays were executed well. And succeeded.
The Jets coaches have to find out what the players on the team are capable of doing well, then practice it until it becomes second nature to the players.
And if that is not good enough, then find better players, and coaches who can get the best from them - consistently, not sporadically.

And, don't worry. If the team should lose enough games to get an impact player in the draft, they'll probably draft a defensive lineman anyhow.

Later

 

[BlindsideD'Brick]

have to agree its the coaching .... there are to many good players underperforming...

memo to TB, change the Fking schemes on D.... Tell your OC to stop with the 5 WR sets and start to run the ball more and use play-action. anything is better than nothing...and that is what we have seen so far,

I'm getting a little tired of the 4 WR sets, too. Especially on 3rd and 1. We've got two decent backs, and our O-line needs to cowboy the "puck" up and start throwing a few blocks in the ground game. Fitz isn't going to Marino us to victory. Gailey needs to wake up and smell the coffee.

 

[Mainejet]

It's not just about getting the wins we should... It's situational... Last year maybe beating up on non winning teams masked a lot of the errors. But now we see clearly.. We need to see in game adjustments.. We need to see better clock management. etc.... Wins over lesser teams won't mask the issues we know Bowles has but in fairness it is just his 2nd year and as much as I said maybe he should be let got.. We know he's not so let's see if he can grow

It's all of what you're taking about and that goes with me saying that he had to fix the teams current problems. But it is MORE in that he's never beaten teams with winning records, he only does it once per season. That MUST change. So even if he improves on his ways and starts to make in game adjustments, has better clock management, etc. it should in addition to this beating teams with winning records. Simply fixing problems he made for himself isn't enough in my estimation. The 2016 Jets is supposed to grow and become a SB contender for 2017 and beyond and currently they are not even close to such a ridiculous claim........

 

[Fudbutter]

The problem is not entirely coaching, it is execution.
Teams knew the Green Bay sweep was coming. They just couldn't stop it.
The Bobby Lane Steelers? The play sequence was fullback Tom Tracy up the middle, running back John Henry Johnson off tackle and then pass to tight end Preston Carpenter. And they kept running that sequence all game until they were stopped or scored.
And there have been other instances where the defense knew what was coming. But the plays were executed well. And succeeded.
The Jets coaches have to find out what the players on the team are capable of doing well, then practice it until it becomes second nature to the players.
And if that is not good enough, then find better players, and coaches who can get the best from them - consistently, not sporadically.

And, don't worry. If the team should lose enough games to get an impact player in the draft, they'll probably draft a defensive lineman anyhow.

Later

Bobby Layne? John Henry Johnson?

Very cool, old man, very cool

 

[NewMFS62]

Bobby Layne? John Henry Johnson?

Very cool, old man, very cool

So, that must mean you remember Tom "The Bomb" Tracy.
Don't give me that old man stuff. You're no kid either. :global (23):

Later