Vic Beasley vs Amari Cooper
- Thread starter Sarge
- Start date
I voted "Beasley", but only based on the assumption that both go on to similar success (I don't know the prospects well enough to say one will BOOM and one will BUST).
I've said it before, but if I have to choose between Lawrence Taylor and Jerry Rice, I choose LT every time. That wouldn't make Cooper a bad pick (which is why I didn't choose "a country mile") -- I just covet an elite pass rusher more than an elite WR . . .
(BTW, those are my top two choices, so great thread!!!)
I've said it before, but if I have to choose between Lawrence Taylor and Jerry Rice, I choose LT every time. That wouldn't make Cooper a bad pick (which is why I didn't choose "a country mile") -- I just covet an elite pass rusher more than an elite WR . . .
(BTW, those are my top two choices, so great thread!!!)
I'm comfortable with our WR group right now so Beasley makes WAY more sense. Adding to that is the fact that we can add a potentially great WR in rounds 3 or 4 in Conley, Green, Lockett, or Diggs. The draft is deep at WR, our team is the deepest it's been in years at WR, and we desperately need an edge rusher and to get younger at LB. This all equals no-brainer in my book.
And this is coming from someone who loves Cooper as a player.
Tough one, it's a win/win with either. For the record, I voted Beasley(tough decision). Ask me tomorrow, I may say Cooper.
Cooper by a country mile because he carries a much higher grade in my view.
Cooper or Fowler would be a much tougher call, but Cooper or Beasley is easy for me.
Cooper or Fowler would be a much tougher call, but Cooper or Beasley is easy for me.
Just curious as to why that is. Beasley showed up at the combine at 6'3 246, ran a 4.53 40, put up 35 reps on the bench, jumped 41". And all he did in college was manage 33 sacks in 39 total games.
Just as a comparison, the "once in a decade talent" Jadeveon Clowney stacked up like this: 6'6 266, 4.53 40, 21 reps on the bench, 37" vert, and had 24 sacks in 37 total games.
On paper, Beasley looks better. Just not sure how anyone can say Cooper carries a much higher grade. I love Cooper and i know this stuff is pretty subjective but it seems you are really denying the accomplishments and the caliber of athlete that Beasley is.
Film don't lie.
I watched about a dozen Alabama Games over the past two years and there hasn't been a moment that I wasn't convinced Amari Cooper is an elite #1 WR at the next level waiting to happen. I've seen him blow games wide open and I've seen him make the difference in close games because he makes the kind of plays in crunch-time that win games. He is the definition of an 'impact player' or 'difference maker', the kind of guys you win championships with.
Full disclosure, I didn't watch nearly as many Clemson Games. I watched a few, but not nearly as many. But even when I watch Beasley's highlight tapes I see a very good player, but not someone who blows me away like Cooper. I like to break my big board down into tiers and I'm pretty stingy with Tier 1. I reserve that tier for only the elite of the elite. I have lots of legit blue-chippers in Tier 2, some you can make an argument for in Tier 1, but like I said, I'm stingy with Tier 1, for me its usually a small group of slam-dunks (metaphorically speaking, because we all know there is no such thing as a sure thing in the draft, but for me Tier 1 are the guys who are as close as you can get). This year I have between four and six players in Tier 1, four if I'm being stingy, six if I'm feeling generous, and either way Beasley isn't one of them. Cooper, OTOH, is amongst the four for me, so generous or stingy, makes no difference, either way I have Cooper in Tier 1.
You still have given no valid reason why Beasley isn't in your tier one, except that you haven't seen him play much, which isn't really a valid reason.
He was probably the best looking specimen at the combine and his production in college rivals anyone in this draft, including Cooper.
He was probably the best looking specimen at the combine and his production in college rivals anyone in this draft, including Cooper.
% of risk here.
Cooper - 5% He is easily could become the next Julio Jones. Decker is 27 and Marshall is 31 & crazy, and Kerley is average @ best.
Beasley - 25% risk simply because he's a DE switching positions which means no sure thing. Just look @ Dion Jordan with the Flippers or Wingo with the Browns. Many posters on this board wanted those players badly, and how are they turning out ?
It's a no brainer for me, and I'm a ACC / Clemson homer ! Draft Cooper @ 6 and Eli Harold a true 3-4 OLB @ 37 and we will be very happy. I can't accept Sammy Coates, Diggs, Lockett, or another Stephen Hill flash in the pan type player like the combine work-out warrior Conley !!!! Draft the sure pick, we've given our defense too many #1 draft choices, it's time to go offense for a change. Cooper.
Go Jets...Cyborg
Cooper - 5% He is easily could become the next Julio Jones. Decker is 27 and Marshall is 31 & crazy, and Kerley is average @ best.
Beasley - 25% risk simply because he's a DE switching positions which means no sure thing. Just look @ Dion Jordan with the Flippers or Wingo with the Browns. Many posters on this board wanted those players badly, and how are they turning out ?
It's a no brainer for me, and I'm a ACC / Clemson homer ! Draft Cooper @ 6 and Eli Harold a true 3-4 OLB @ 37 and we will be very happy. I can't accept Sammy Coates, Diggs, Lockett, or another Stephen Hill flash in the pan type player like the combine work-out warrior Conley !!!! Draft the sure pick, we've given our defense too many #1 draft choices, it's time to go offense for a change. Cooper.
Go Jets...Cyborg
Vernon Gholston led all of D1A in sacks and he broke Ohio State's record for sacks in a single season the year we took him at I believe #6 , and his combine performance was off the charts. A lot of Jets fans remember the latter and insist we drafted a workout warrior, but its not true because they conveniently overlook the former. So everything you are saying about Beasley could have been said about Gholston. That doesn't make him Vernon Gholston, I'm just saying, sometimes stats lie, but the tape doesn't lie, and lets be honest, highlight reels by definition are designed to show the player in his very best light, so if your highlight reels don't necessarily blow me away, then there's no way I can put you in Tier 1. That said, I like Beasley's tape, but I'm not blown away by it. Cooper OTOH I don't even need to see his tape because I saw so many of his games, and I came away profoundly impressed, convinced I was watching an elite #1 WR. I'm okay with it if the Jets take Beasley, but there's no way I would take him over Cooper.
Did anyone catch the interview with Landon Collins S from Alabama yesterday. He was asked who was the most dangerous WR he's ever had to cover in his career, and he said without question, it's the guy I have to practice against everyday Amari Cooper. He said no Alabama player works harder than Cooper, and that he even skipped Spring Break to stay on campus to work-out. He's a great kid and not a typical WR premadonna / Diva type.
Go Jets...Cyborg
Go Jets...Cyborg
Even if those percentages were accurate in general terms, IMO they aren't in respect to the Jets.
Bring a "good" pass rusher onto this team and watch him become elite, simply because of the talent around him.
Bring an "elite" WR and watch him become pedestrian until we have a quality QB behind center.
If the talent level is truly that vast, I agree go with the better prospect. But I don't see how a WR will take this team further than a pass rusher will, especially not today, and likely ever . . .
J
Jet Setter
Guest
Yeah, let's face it, you're not going to go wrong in picking Cooper. To me, he's a true #1 and built rugged enough to endure a long career. Smart, balanced route runner with great hands who will always be productive in the NFL. How often do you get a chance to draft a player like him? It's not an easy call. This team could still survive the next season without addressing pass rusher. I could see Coples on the weak (pass rushing) side and platoon Pace and IK on the strong side and with our strong DLine, they'd be just fine. You can get pass rushers every year and I would argue that the difference between the top tier this draft and the 2nd tier is negligible at best. And BTW, Dupree may very well be the best of this year's class...but he's not getting past 10 IMO.
And the Jets could still address pass rusher in the 2nd round. Eli Harold, Odiguizuwa (one of my favorites), Danielle Hunter as well as Bernardrick McKinney (as an OLB) and sleeper Davis Tull who are both heavily linked to the Jets could be in play in the 2nd round where we have the 5th pick.
I can argue both ways on this issue and would be happy in either scenario. But this all hinges on the Raiders who up to now have not pursued WR's in FA. This is telling in that they are likely targeting either Cooper or White with their pick. I would assume Cooper is the far better prospect for a developing young QB but the Raiders don't often use conventional wisdom.
As of this time I'd go with Beasley (that could change before the draft) 
We are missing that edge pass rushing dynamic that could make our defense elite.
I also think Beasley may have what it takes to be great (same thoughts on Fowler and Dupree).
With Revis and Cro at the corners I believe we will be blitzing much more this year.
A great pass rusher will be needed and from what I've read coach Bowles loves to blitz.
Its a tough pick for me though as I think Cooper with a good offense and QB could catch 80+ balls as a rookie.
He's as NFL ready as your going to get, played against great competition in the SEC, and has all the intangibles you look for in a WR (good speed, excellent body control, great route runner, plays up not down to the competition, knows how to get open, wants the football at all times).
What leans me towards Beasley is the fact that we now have Marshall, Decker, Kerley, and I'm thinking another one of our wide-outs will step up for us this year.
OLB are always a risky pick and I agree with those that say Cooper is the "safer" pick.
But an elite edge rusher is more of a need right now IMO.
I wouldn't shed a tear though if we went with Cooper; who btw is my favorite Wideout in the draft.
We are missing that edge pass rushing dynamic that could make our defense elite.
I also think Beasley may have what it takes to be great (same thoughts on Fowler and Dupree).
With Revis and Cro at the corners I believe we will be blitzing much more this year.
A great pass rusher will be needed and from what I've read coach Bowles loves to blitz.
Its a tough pick for me though as I think Cooper with a good offense and QB could catch 80+ balls as a rookie.
He's as NFL ready as your going to get, played against great competition in the SEC, and has all the intangibles you look for in a WR (good speed, excellent body control, great route runner, plays up not down to the competition, knows how to get open, wants the football at all times).
What leans me towards Beasley is the fact that we now have Marshall, Decker, Kerley, and I'm thinking another one of our wide-outs will step up for us this year.
OLB are always a risky pick and I agree with those that say Cooper is the "safer" pick.
But an elite edge rusher is more of a need right now IMO.
I wouldn't shed a tear though if we went with Cooper; who btw is my favorite Wideout in the draft.
Like Mark, Geno can't seem to surpass the 60% completion percentage. While I can remember some easy drops, I remember WAY more passes that missed an open receiver by 5 yards.
I'm not sure even an elite receiver can compensate for that, which is why I'm slightly nervous about Marshall's reaction to playing here . . .
i picked cooper in a very difficult decision.
i agree that OLB is a greater need, but what led me to cooper were a few things:
- we've invested a lot more in the defense than the offense this off-season. we had a good defense to start with, and then added revis, cro, skrine and gilchrist, while re-signing harris. for the offense, we've added marshall, carpenter and fitz, while re-signing powell. (wow - macc has been busy). also, the offense lost CJ and harvin.
- we've used our last 6 1st round picks on defense. the last #1 spent on offense was sanchez
- imo, cooper is the "safer" pick. not that we should make a pick based on safeness, but in this case, i don't think safe limits upside. beasley is rising up the draft boards now after the combine, which worries me a little (ok, unfairly the ghost of vernon gholston keeps re-appearing).
so factoring in all these things, while OLB is a bigger need, if push came to shove and i was making the pick, i'd go with cooper
i agree that OLB is a greater need, but what led me to cooper were a few things:
- we've invested a lot more in the defense than the offense this off-season. we had a good defense to start with, and then added revis, cro, skrine and gilchrist, while re-signing harris. for the offense, we've added marshall, carpenter and fitz, while re-signing powell. (wow - macc has been busy). also, the offense lost CJ and harvin.
- we've used our last 6 1st round picks on defense. the last #1 spent on offense was sanchez
- imo, cooper is the "safer" pick. not that we should make a pick based on safeness, but in this case, i don't think safe limits upside. beasley is rising up the draft boards now after the combine, which worries me a little (ok, unfairly the ghost of vernon gholston keeps re-appearing).
so factoring in all these things, while OLB is a bigger need, if push came to shove and i was making the pick, i'd go with cooper