Fitzpatrick Thread -- Ryan Fitzpatrick, Jets agree to 1-year, $12M deal

[BlindsideD'Brick]

It's funny to me how I read all this Geno bashing from fans, and then you read players comments from star players like Brandon Marshall and Eric Decker saying nothing but positive things about Geno's potential. Just today, Marshall said Geno looks like a new guy. Gailey has repeated several times that he sees Geno growing.

But that won't change the minds of the "minds made up" fanbase. Geno sucks and I don't wanna hear ANYTHING ELSE!!! And the explanation given is that this is all a smokescreen by players and coaches who are just trying their hardest not to reveal some supposed truth.

Before I get sandblasted as a Geno fanboy, lover, or other juvenile taunt, I also reiterate that I fully support the return of Fitzpatrick as our starter (over Geno) at the right price. I believe it will happen. And I also believe that our QB situation will be fine with Geno as a backup. Carry four QB's. What the hell? Why do we have to do what Cimini and Mehta tell us we should do?

 

[jetgreen13]

It is completely relevant. It is only the Jets themselves that set the value so high. Bidding against themselves. Same old Jets.

spin it anyway you like RI.. i'm done debating 2+2 doesn't equal 4..

 

[hobson54]

It's funny to me how I read all this Geno bashing from fans, and then you read players comments from star players like Brandon Marshall and Eric Decker saying nothing but positive things about Geno's potential. Just today, Marshall said Geno looks like a new guy. Gailey has repeated several times that he sees Geno growing.

But that won't change the minds of the "minds made up" fanbase. Geno sucks and I don't wanna hear ANYTHING ELSE!!! And the explanation given is that this is all a smokescreen by players and coaches who are just trying their hardest not to reveal some supposed truth.

Before I get sandblasted as a Geno fanboy, lover, or other juvenile taunt, I also reiterate that I fully support the return of Fitzpatrick as our starter (over Geno) at the right price. I believe it will happen. And I also believe that our QB situation will be fine with Geno as a backup. Carry four QB's. What the hell? Why do we have to do what Cimini and Mehta tell us we should do?

brick, you know i have a ton of respect for you and would never bash you as some geno apologist. but i personally cannot fathom another season of watching geno as the starting QB of the jets. granted it is a purely visceral reaction and i readily admit i could be wrong and he could turn it around. but the thought of it makes me ill.

 

[hobson54]

spin it anyway you like RI.. i'm done debating 2+2 doesn't equal 4..

don't you understand....armchair GMs are never wrong. the market rate is what the internet experts determine it to be, not what the other starting QBs in the league actually make.

 

[Jet Fan RI]

It's funny to me how I read all this Geno bashing from fans, and then you read players comments from star players like Brandon Marshall and Eric Decker saying nothing but positive things about Geno's potential. Just today, Marshall said Geno looks like a new guy. Gailey has repeated several times that he sees Geno growing.

But that won't change the minds of the "minds made up" fanbase. Geno sucks and I don't wanna hear ANYTHING ELSE!!! And the explanation given is that this is all a smokescreen by players and coaches who are just trying their hardest not to reveal some supposed truth.

Before I get sandblasted as a Geno fanboy, lover, or other juvenile taunt, I also reiterate that I fully support the return of Fitzpatrick as our starter (over Geno) at the right price. I believe it will happen. And I also believe that our QB situation will be fine with Geno as a backup. Carry four QB's. What the hell? Why do we have to do what Cimini and Mehta tell us we should do?

This makes a lot of sense. Agree completely.

 

[Jet Fan RI]

don't you understand....armchair GMs are never wrong. the market rate is what the internet experts determine it to be, not what the other starting QBs in the league actually make.

Actually, the market value is set by the offers that are made. The value is currently $12M only because that is what the Jets, and only the Jets, have offered. Of course, we can still hold out hope. If Fitz waits too long the offer may come off the table.

 

[JohnnyBaseball1]

It's funny to me how I read all this Geno bashing from fans, and then you read players comments from star players like Brandon Marshall and Eric Decker saying nothing but positive things about Geno's potential. Just today, Marshall said Geno looks like a new guy. Gailey has repeated several times that he sees Geno growing.

Players don't say bad things about their teammates, typically, and neither do coaches say bad things about their players. If you really think about what they're saying, it isn't all that complimentary. Positive comments about a player's potential are akin to comments saying that the player has yet to reach his potential, i.e. he has played poorly. Saying he looks like a new guy, similarly, is the same as saying "the guy he has been in the past isn't good enough, or even at all" (if it is a compliment to say you're a whole new guy, then it must mean that the guy you were before wasn't good) and "seeing growth" is the same thing. All of the comments are damning him with faint praise. Players who play well have people say things about him like "he's great," or "he's an excellent player" or whatever. In the end, all the comments basically boil down to "he has to improve" which I think everyone agrees with, and "he is improving," which is more controversial. They'll never take the step of saying that they don't believe he can improve, even if they believed that. His teammates will say he's showing signs of improvement until the day he's out of the league (or improves enough to receive the "he's a good player" comments instead). I don't think there's any requirement to consider these types of comments when evaluating players, personally, because the statements are boilerplate, essentially. You could dig up a million quotes like this for all sorts of athletes who couldn't succeed at the highest level.

 

[BlindsideD'Brick]

Players don't say bad things about their teammates, typically, and neither do coaches say bad things about their players. If you really think about what they're saying, it isn't all that complimentary. Positive comments about a player's potential are akin to comments saying that the player has yet to reach his potential, i.e. he has played poorly. Saying he looks like a new guy, similarly, is the same as saying "the guy he has been in the past isn't good enough, or even at all" (if it is a compliment to say you're a whole new guy, then it must mean that the guy you were before wasn't good) and "seeing growth" is the same thing. All of the comments are damning him with faint praise. Players who play well have people say things about him like "he's great," or "he's an excellent player" or whatever. In the end, all the comments basically boil down to "he has to improve" which I think everyone agrees with, and "he is improving," which is more controversial. They'll never take the step of saying that they don't believe he can improve, even if they believed that. His teammates will say he's showing signs of improvement until the day he's out of the league (or improves enough to receive the "he's a good player" comments instead). I don't think there's any requirement to consider these types of comments when evaluating players, personally, because the statements are boilerplate, essentially. You could dig up a million quotes like this for all sorts of athletes who couldn't succeed at the highest level.

I see a lot of interpretation on this matter. I'm not saying I'm certain how the team feels about Geno. For all I know, they could be lying. But as fans we have to take things at face value, because that's all we can do. The media, on the other hand, loves creating stories because it legitimizes their existence. They love reading tea leaves.

My eyes have seen some very good things from Geno Smith, some very bad things from Geno Smith, and some things in between. I'm not sold on him being a reclamation project anymore than I'm sold on him being a bust. I don't judge players drafted in the second round nowadays because it's not fair to them, IMO. I want to see a competition in training camp, and a solid "go-to" as a #2 should our #1 get injured.

Call me nuts, but I believe Geno is the best option as a backup if Fitz gets hurt. Petty and Hackenberg are 2017 options.

 

[SackExchange]

Fitz's market value was established by his testing of the FA market. What was the highest offer he had before the Jets made their nonsensical $12M offer? An offer of $6M is a 100% pay raise, more than generous. And I would have no problem with combining a $6M guaranteed offer with incentives that would bring it to $12M.

We really don't know what the highest offer was. I'm not sure, but I don't think he had more than around $7MM on the table, and that was to back up.

 

[SackExchange]

well if you want to use the real estate analogy, one would think you would look at what other homes in the neighborhood go for. the best comparable for "other homes in the neighborhood" for an athlete would be what his peers make. and given that 22 or so QBs make $12 million or more (with a handful of the lower paid ones restricted by rookie contracts - call it affordable housing allotments), then offering $6 million for a neighborhood that averages well over $12 million seems to be a way to prevent a deal from getting done.

it's clear you don't think fitz should get more than $6 million. but the market pay for starting QBs is a lot more than that.

now maybe you prefer to pay less for a QB. but then you should be prepared for results more in line with what we saw in 2013 and 2014 from the jets QB position. i guess having the 30th or so ranked QB and having more Ints and TDs is worth it for you to go "cheap" on the position.

To me, this is the analogy that makes sense.

Now, of course you will try to get a property as cheap as you can, if you're the buyer. But the seller is under no obligation to sell to you, rather than waiting it out.

For all the talk of Same Ol' Jets, to me, SOJ would be sticking to some ridiculous low number that fans think Fitz is worth, all based on the false premise that he has only had one good season, and then see another team lose their starting QB at the beginning of camp and bring in Fitz to replace him.

Then what? Geno? I'd be fine if this season was used for one of the other young QBs to cut his teeth and get past the growing pains, but if it's Geno and his ridiculously low ceiling, no thanks.

 

[Pattycakes]

It's funny to me how I read all this Geno bashing from fans, and then you read players comments from star players like Brandon Marshall and Eric Decker saying nothing but positive things about Geno's potential. Just today, Marshall said Geno looks like a new guy. Gailey has repeated several times that he sees Geno growing.

But that won't change the minds of the "minds made up" fanbase. Geno sucks and I don't wanna hear ANYTHING ELSE!!! And the explanation given is that this is all a smokescreen by players and coaches who are just trying their hardest not to reveal some supposed truth.

Before I get sandblasted as a Geno fanboy, lover, or other juvenile taunt, I also reiterate that I fully support the return of Fitzpatrick as our starter (over Geno) at the right price. I believe it will happen. And I also believe that our QB situation will be fine with Geno as a backup. Carry four QB's. What the hell? Why do we have to do what Cimini and Mehta tell us we should do?

i agree 100%. I really do want Fitz back, I think he gives us the best chance to win. I also believe he will be the starting quarterback on this team in week one against the Bengals... But if he continues down this path, let Geno play. If he doesn't want to take $12m, fine. He can sit this year and we'll figure it out.

 

[jetgreen13]

I see a lot of interpretation on this matter. I'm not saying I'm certain how the team feels about Geno. For all I know, they could be lying. But as fans we have to take things at face value, because that's all we can do. The media, on the other hand, loves creating stories because it legitimizes their existence. They love reading tea leaves.

My eyes have seen some very good things from Geno Smith, some very bad things from Geno Smith, and some things in between. I'm not sold on him being a reclamation project anymore than I'm sold on him being a bust. I don't judge players drafted in the second round nowadays because it's not fair to them, IMO. I want to see a competition in training camp, and a solid "go-to" as a #2 should our #1 get injured.

Call me nuts, but I believe Geno is the best option as a backup if Fitz gets hurt. Petty and Hackenberg are 2017 options.

speak for yourself.. i & all fans have the right to make educated guesses (or otherwise for that matter) on sports forums.. what would be the point in coming here if we all blindly took everything we watch, hear & read about the jets at "face value??"

hell, if JFU members took your advise, JFU wouldn't exist..

 

[SackExchange]

speak for yourself.. i & all fans have the right to make educated guesses (or otherwise for that matter) on sports forums.. what would be the point in coming here if we all blindly took everything we watch, hear & read about the jets at "face value??"

hell, if JFU members took your advise, JFU wouldn't exist..

The problem is, many fans often fail to recognize that their opinions come with both a lack of professional experience and a lack of access to information. So those guesses are only semi-educated.

 

[mykcuz]

It's funny to me how I read all this Geno bashing from fans, and then you read players comments from star players like Brandon Marshall and Eric Decker saying nothing but positive things about Geno's potential. Just today, Marshall said Geno looks like a new guy. Gailey has repeated several times that he sees Geno growing.

But that won't change the minds of the "minds made up" fanbase. Geno sucks and I don't wanna hear ANYTHING ELSE!!! And the explanation given is that this is all a smokescreen by players and coaches who are just trying their hardest not to reveal some supposed truth.

Before I get sandblasted as a Geno fanboy, lover, or other juvenile taunt, I also reiterate that I fully support the return of Fitzpatrick as our starter (over Geno) at the right price. I believe it will happen. And I also believe that our QB situation will be fine with Geno as a backup. Carry four QB's. What the hell? Why do we have to do what Cimini and Mehta tell us we should do?

The Jets would be pretty stupid to let geno play out his contract this year without resigning him, while offering Fitz 12 million, if geno is a new qb.
Players have to support each other, even if geno is your qb.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[mykcuz]

The problem is, many fans often fail to recognize that their opinions come with both a lack of professional experience and a lack of access to information. So those guesses are only semi-educated.

Hey, I called 12 mill on here for months.

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[OCCH]

Hey, I called 12 mill on here for months.

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And apparently Fitz has rejected it for months, so the question is where does it go from here . . .

 

[mykcuz]

And apparently Fitz has rejected it for months, so the question is where does it go from here . . .

Rumor is he's fine with 12,not 6 for year 2 and 3.
Why not do 3 for 36 and only guarantee a year and a half. Fitz gets the yearly salary, we can cut him if he's bad.

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[jetgreen13]

The problem is, many fans often fail to recognize that their opinions come with both a lack of professional experience and a lack of access to information. So those guesses are only semi-educated.

well personally, i'm happy for the "problem.."

i just checked, we both have well over 2,000 posts here.. i absolutely wouldn't if all i was doing was saying to myself.. well bowles said up, so it must be up.. mac said down, so it must be down.. decker said left, so it must be left.. & fitzpatrick said right, so it must in fact be right.. if that was my experience at JFU i would simply go to the jets official website & be down with it..

& i certainly don't need someone to tell me how to form my opinions.. i'm sure you don't either..

 

[SackExchange]

well personally, i'm happy for the "problem.."

i just checked, we both have well over 2,000 posts here.. i absolutely wouldn't if all i was doing was saying to myself.. well bowles said up, so it must be up.. mac said down, so it must be down.. decker said left, so it must be left.. & fitzpatrick said right, so it must in fact be right.. if that was my experience at JFU i would simply go to the jets official website & be down with it..

& i certainly don't need someone to tell me how to form my opinions.. i'm sure you don't either..

No, neither of us need anyone to tell us how to formulate our opinions. But when some of us here presume our opinions to be greater than those who are actually making the decisions, when they have much greater access to scouting, film, resources, experience, etc., it does seem a bit flawed.

 

[SackExchange]

It sounds like it is close to done with a one-year deal. The Daily News and PFT are running with it.